Episode Number: 162

Episode 162- How to Create a Life by Design and Combine Creativity and Commerce with Lisa Nicole Bell

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Jamila Souffrant 00:00

You're listening to the Journey to Launch Podcast How to Create a Life By Design and Combine Creativity and Commerce with Lisa Nicole Bell.

Recording 00:13

Welcome to the Journey to Launch Podcast with your host Jamila Souffrant. As a money expert who walks her talk, she helps brave journeyers like you get out of debt, save, invest, and build real wealth. Join her on the journey to launch to financial freedom in five, four, three, two, one.

Jamila Souffrant 00:39

Hey, hey, hey journeyers, welcome to the Journey to Launch Podcast as I always am. I'm really excited to speak to you today. You know episode comes out every Wednesday morning. You may be listening to this in real time, or maybe a few days after, maybe months years after. My goal with this podcast is to keep this content evergreen so it doesn't matter when you listen it's relevant to you. And I think this is going to be one of those conversations that can be replayed at any time because I have on the amazing Lisa Nicole Bell as today's guest.

Jamila Souffrant 01:11

Let me tell you a little bit about Lisa. Lisa is a producer, writer, media personality and serial entrepreneur. Her career melds, creativity and commerce and she uses media and technology to shift and shape culture. As a multidisciplinary creator, she's produced more than 300 hours of content, her work spans scripted, unscripted and digital verticals. She's a creator, executive producer, and she's also the host of the Behind the Brilliance Podcast where I was once a guest. So I'll also link that in the show notes. But she really is such a powerful, brilliant mind. And I've listened to her podcasts and I love how she breaks information down. I love how she summarizes and relates it in a way that it's just like yes, you just get it you you feel inspired to take action to learn more. You'll hear it through our conversations, I'm really excited for you to hear this. On the podcast, we're going to be talking about a range of subjects, you know, I really want you to hone in on whatever speaks to you. But we're going to be talking about creating a life by design. And I think that this is one of the gifts and ways in which when you see people really succeeding at life, it's because they decided to get into the driver's seat, they decided that they were going to decide what happened to them. Regardless of circumstances, they were going to be intentional about the life they created. And I also love that she's able to bridge that gap between creativity and money. So you'll hear she has a very creative mind, and she's done a lot of work in the creative field, but she also makes money. And I think for a lot of people, sometimes it's hard to, you know, passion or money and I think you can do both. And we're going to talk all about that.

Jamila Souffrant 02:46

So, grab a pencil, grab paper, or make sure you're ready to maybe replay this conversation because I think it's going to be that good. If you want the episodes show notes for this episode, go to or you can click the description of wherever you're listening to this episode to get the full episode show notes. Now if you are a new listener to the podcast or an OG journeyer I've created a Jumpstart Guide to help you on your journey to financial freedom. It includes the top episodes to listen to, the stages to go through to reach financial freedom, resources to help you, and so much more. Get it for FREE by texting, launch to 33777 text launch to 33777 or go to to get your guide for free right now. Okay, let's hop into the episode.

Jamila Souffrant 03:08

Okay, journeyers, I have a real special treat. I have Lisa Nicole Bell on the podcast. Hi, Lisa.

Lisa Nicole Bell 03:48

Hi. Thank you for having me.

Jamila Souffrant 03:50

Of course and I am excited to have you on the podcast because I admire your work and we're going to get into what that is. I read your bio before we officially started. And so people kind of have an idea if they don't know who you are already. But what I love about you and your platform, and what you talk about is you bring this multifaceted approach to life and being a black woman at that and break barriers on like what you can do and be. I just feel like when I see what you've done, like even reading your bio, and all the things you've accomplished, and how you approach even with your podcast, interviewing people, because I feel like it's similar in the sense that I don't tap into just one type of person. I talk to whoever I can learn from, and distill that information that I think that you just have a way with living through your life experience, teaching people how to build a life by design. And so I'm really looking forward to talking to you about all the things.

Lisa Nicole Bell 04:45

Yeah, likewise.

Jamila Souffrant 04:48

So you are a self proclaimed and just, I mean, it's in the receipts, you're a serial entrepreneur. So you've started multiple businesses, companies, your film and TV producer, you host a podcast, you have all these things about you, right? And most of them stem from the creative side. And it also allows you to earn money. So I want to talk about that. What did you get to degree in Business Law? Right?

Lisa Nicole Bell 05:13

Yeah, business law.

Jamila Souffrant 05:14

So how did you come from that to being this creative that does all the projects that you do? Like, how did you switch careers at some point? Or how do you find that?

Lisa Nicole Bell 05:22

That's a really good question that I never get. So my inclination, even coming out of high school, and kind of trying to figure out what I was going to do was always that I wanted to be in control of my career, whatever that meant. And I didn't have obviously the clarity then that I have now but I had an intuitive vision about what that might be. And my whole thing was like, whatever I study needs to yield a return. I know that I can decide to do lots of different things and I can always go to grad school and that kind of thing, but like if I'm going to invest the money and the time to go to school to college and do a formal education. I need to come out of college feeling like I can recoup that investment very quickly. So actually started as a political science major, mostly because I just love history and people and all that not because I was planning to run for office. So I would be in these classes and the other students passionate, they were like, no city council needs to do this. And I was just like, Oh, it's not that serious. I just like reading the stories. I like Lisa, you need to move on to something that you feel that passionate about where you're you want to argue and debate with people and all of that. So I thought, Well, okay. When I was thinking about all the different things that I wanted to do, I was like, okay, you could do English, you could do creative writing, you could do screen writing, you could do film. But then what is the long term vision? What is the 20 year vision I was like, well beyond the things that I want to do creatively, like I am an entrepreneur, I I'm a hustler at heart, and I want to make things I want to be able to make things happen. And so I was like, alright, well let me switch to business and see how that goes. Because I feel like that will be useful. And then I fell madly in love. I was like, this is it. Because whether I need to understand marketing for business, whether I need to be able to read my own contracts for personal projects or something else, if I want to be able to invest in real estate, if I want to be able to build a business from the ground up, like everything that I'm learning, in this degree is going to be useful, and the creative magic is on me. But this offers me information and structure to be able to do this in a way that's like organized and professional. So it felt like a good decision and even during the time I was in undergrad, I was doing bit roles and film and TV as an actress. I was booking all kinds of commercials. That was around the time I started my first company and grew it and then sold it shortly after undergrad. So like I just got into this rhythm of like, let's just try and stuff and see what happened. That's how I ended up being a creative who has a business degree.

Jamila Souffrant 08:09

Do you feel like you could pin back to what gave you the confidence in undergrad to pursue that degree? Like you said, You started a company. So I want and so then I want to get to that. And you were doing all these things. And I find sometimes that I had a similar experience where when I was in college, I was very ambitious. So that's what helped me have the vision to buy my first property where people were just like, how did you even I was not thinking about that in college, you know? So, and I can go back to where it came from. Like it was really from seeing my mom and grandma like what they were able to accomplish. I was like, I can do something here like that instilled in me hard work, and I always had this confidence that I can do anything I set my mind to. So can you go back and think about what it is in your upbringing that allowed you in your college years to be so bold?

Lisa Nicole Bell 08:51

Yes, I played sports, most of elementary school and into middle school, and basketball and volleyball. I was playing those Couple of consecutive years and then I decided I wanted to try softball because I was raised on the Atlanta Braves. I loved baseball. So I was like, Oh, you know, I want to try softball. So I tried out for the softball team. I made it. I'm excited. I'm like, Yes. You know, now I'm playing sports year round. This is great. You know, studies have shown that sports are great for self esteem for girls. There were other girls on the team who had played in years prior. This is my first year and the coach was like, Yeah, you're gonna be in the outfield. And I was like, Okay, cool. Like, I didn't know what that meant. But the outfield for girls softball is not the same as the outfield for professional baseball, like the outfield in professional baseball is hype. Like the ball comes out there. They run, they jump, they do things. It's interesting, the team is counting on them. But if you're like fifth grade, and you're playing softball, you're out there counting weeds contemplating the meaning of life like there's nothing interesting happening in the outfield. All the action is on the in field. And I was like, No, no, I'm super good on this.

Lisa Nicole Bell 10:07

So it's the end of my first season, I go to the coach. And I'm like, yeah, I'm all set on being the outfield. I don't want to do that. I want to be the pitcher. And she's looking at me like I grew three head. She's like, what? No, you can't be the pitcher like you've only done one season. You're not that great. You don't have the talent. No, you can't do that. And I was like, you have to let me try out though. And she was like, well, the rules for the little league that we were in, she's like, well, the rules stipulate that if a girl wants to try out for a position, we have to let her but I'm telling you, you're not going to be better than the picture that we have. So you're not going to get chosen and I was like beat. So I go to my dad and I'm like, I want to be pitcher next year. And he's like, Okay, I'm like and I will do whatever I have to do. So I'm going to get up every morning before school, and I'm going to throw 100 pitches. On the weekends on holidays. You and I are going to the batting cages and we're going to the field and we're going to throw pitches, we're going to work on my strike zone, we're going to work on my speed, we're going to work on my arm, all of that and he's like, Alright, I'm in whatever you want to do. I'm going to support you. I work like a maniac. Like I took. I remember getting some spray paint, and drawing like a circle where the strike zone was on the side of our house. And just like getting up and throwing by my mom is like, you can't spray paint the house. Like, I was like, no sis like, no, I got it. This has to happen.

Lisa Nicole Bell 11:35

The following spring rolls around. And it's time like I've put in almost an entire year of work. I've missed out on hanging out with my friends. I've gotten up early and all of that and spring tryouts. Come, tryouts come. I'm in my zone. I'm like, I got this. My arm is a robot at this point. Let's do this. Go to the tryouts with me and this other girl named Crystal. Crystal goes first. Crystal's hitting it and she's doing her thing. She's like doing all of her drills. Great job, Crystal. All right, here comes Lisa and the coaches just like this is so ridiculous. I can't believe we're doing this. I'm like, I don't care, you would have thought that I was in a three piece suit. I was like, it doesn't matter. I'm gonna take my time and do my thing. There throw in the ball. I'm like hitting everything I'm pitching. I'm in the strike zone, Strike, Strike strike. Her jaw is on the ground, because she's like, how is this girl this good? Like she was I didn't even know how is this possible? The following morning, I get a phone call from her. And she's like, first I have to apologize because I underestimated you. But second, you're going to be our pitcher this season. Your tryout was better than Crystal's. And it was better than the other girls who tried out. And so you know, congratulations. And so the lesson there was I can do whatever I decide I want to do if I'm willing to learn what I need to learn and work with As I need to work. So that completely changed my sense of what is possible for me in a way that was self directed, right? Because it's not like grades like, Okay, I'm making C's, and I need to make A's so that I can get off punishment. This was something that I wanted. For me, there was no extrinsic reward for it other than getting to be a pitcher and having the fun of doing that. And so the journey of saying this is something I want to do in four months, no one will even know I'm working on this. I just have to give my my all to it. It was life changing. So that was the thing that I think was an inflection point in the sense that like as an entrepreneur and creative you just do it.

Jamila Souffrant 13:44

Yeah. And it's such a gift. When you have that type of thought process or when you have the ability to see what's not there. Because oftentimes, you know, you're placed in situation you're you're may be born in situations you find yourself where that's just what it seemingly is. There may be something inside of you, you listening right now you're just like, I know, there's more. Like there's something else just there is more for me. And you have to kind of have that vision to say, all right, there's something else and sometimes you see it in other people, which is helpful. So you see someone else that you're inspired by or that's doing something you may be interested in. Sometimes you don't even have that you don't see it, but you know, something else is there and, and just believing that you can possibly do it is like the first step. And I think so many people, anyone that I've talked to that had success in life in any area, whatever that is, whatever that is, it's that it's seeing something outside of who they currently are, and just believing that they have a chance at it.

Lisa Nicole Bell 14:40

That's where it starts.

Jamila Souffrant 14:42

So you said you started a business in college and sold it.

Lisa Nicole Bell 14:44


Jamila Souffrant 14:45

Can you talk a little bit about that? So you started being entrepreneur early on and were successful at it?

Lisa Nicole Bell 14:50


Jamila Souffrant 14:50

What was that first business and then why'd you sell it. And then I'm gonna like lead up to all the other stuff that you started to do.

Lisa Nicole Bell 14:56

This company started because I got fired for insubordination. And I called my dad in tears. It was like, they fired me. They said, I'm insubordinate. I like didn't even really know what that meant. And he was like, well, Lisa, you have a specific way you like things done. And if you think you can do it better than they can then you should start your own thing. And he just kind of like I said this off the cuff. And I'm like, you know what, you're right. Not even realizing like what I was getting myself into. But I'm like, Okay, I'm studying business in school. And I've had my share of like, little side hustles and things, why not? So I realize that there is a gap. So in the state of California, they have a different kind of standardized testing beyond the ACT and the SAT they had something at the time called ISEE they had all these other tests. And so this was around the time that like Kumon and Sylvan existed in terms of like tutoring and test prep, but I thought, well, it's fine if you come in and work math problems with Timmy. But there should be a personal development angle. Why are we talking about courage? Why aren't we talking about patience and how those things show up on the playground or at school? So like, I'm going to try this and see what happens. So I just started out doing it myself. And I couldn't believe how much people were willing to pay. Like people were willing to pay $30 an hour. When you're a college kid, that's a lot of money.

Jamila Souffrant 16:24

And this is you teaching their kids?

Lisa Nicole Bell 16:26

Yeah, this is me going in and being like, Okay, I'm going to tutor your kid, because I was like, looking at jobs, regular jobs, and the hourly rate, there was just this weird gap. Because before that I had come from retail. I had been promoted. And they wanted me to become a district manager for a retailer. I had no interest in doing that. I was like, I'm not trying to be vice president or CEO of a retailerdo. This is not my dream. So I was like, this is a job for me, not a career. And they were like, well, it's time for you to move up. And I was like, well, I quit. I mean, I guess if you are college educated or you're a student in college, that's your credentials, but I felt like you don't really have to have any credentials to work with these students. So one day, I'm talking to one of the parents, and she goes, um, you know, I know you come here every day at three, like, I was wondering, you know, one of my friends is also looking for someone, do you have someone else who works with you? And I was like, "Yes, yes, I do."

Lisa Nicole Bell 17:29

I will. By the time we need to do this. The next day in class. I'm talking to one of my friends and she worked at this little juice bar on campus. I was like, Hey, what do you how much do you make at the juice bar? Like $10 an hour? $11 an hour. I was like, check this out. I'll pay you $20 an hour. If you want to tutor this kid in English. She's like, what, I was like, yeah, I'll pay you $20 an hour. She's like, you don't even have the money. I'm like, trust me. I got it. And I'm good for it. But she's like, Okay, give me the address. I'm like, this is how you have to do it. And then after you finished the the lesson, you're going to talk about ambition. Okay? And this is what I want you to say. So I'm laying out my little script for her she like, okay, so she does it and it it goes well. I'm like, alright, that was a $10 margin because I paid her 20 bucks. The family pay me 30 bucks. So I made $10 an hour and I wasn't even there. It was over after that. I was like, Oh, I was doing the Birdman hand rub. I was like, let's go.

Lisa Nicole Bell 18:29

From there. I was just scaling up. I took myself completely out of it. I was like, nope, I'm about to be hiring all these students. And because the other thing was, I was like, look, if you go from working with your regular family to affluent families, we're talking about $70 $80 $90 an hour that they're happy to pay to someone who has expertise. So from there, I scaled the company up and it was one of those things where it reached a point where it was like, okay, we have grown throughout LA County. Starting in the Valley moving on to the West Side, I'm starting to have clients in Santa Monica moving on to Orange County. And I was like, all right, well, is this something that you really want to do? Do you want to be Sylvan? Do you want to be Kumon? Do you want to have locations scattered throughout the country? Like if that's your dream, I was like, No, that doesn't feel like freedom that feels like a prison that feels like waking up in five years, and kind of dreading it and just doing it because it pays really well. And because I can do it in my sleep. That's never what I signed up for. So maybe three or four months after I started to feel that way. I was approached by this company that was just kind of buying up business assets. And they were like, you know, we're interested in making an investment. And I was like, Well, I'm not taking investment money right now because I'm trying to figure out how to get out like I'm looking forward to so I can remove myself from this because at that time, I thought, I'm going to bring in a CEO, I'll be President this will just be a passive income vehicle, I'll move on to something else. They were like, well, you know, we'll cut you a check for like, well, we'll acquire it. And I was like, uh, yeah, the numbers worked for where I was at the time. And so I offloaded it and felt really good about it. At the time, I didn't even really have context for like, you're having an exit. It was just like, I built a thing, and it was valuable. And this is my transition out.

Jamila Souffrant 20:27

So you have to disclose exactly the amount but was it kind of like money where you didn't have to work for a while? Or more just good seed money for something else?

Lisa Nicole Bell 20:35

Yeah. It was like, waking up, and then being like, well, what am I going to do now? Because for a lot of people, they think they want money, they think they want an exit. They think, oh, if I had a lot of money, I would do this and this and this. But it's like once you come into a large sum of money, you get revealed to yourself because if you're not super self directed and thoughtful, you will end up lacking purpose. It's fun the first couple of weeks because it's like a really expensive spring break. You know, you take a trip somewhere exotic, you go to Hawaii or something. You buy toys, you spend money on silly things. But then after that, you know, as a human being, you need to be doing something constructive in order to feel purposeful. So yeah, it was definitely enough money to take time off. But what I quickly learned was that I don't do well with being in a vacuum like that, like me taking six months off to just kind of do nothing is not really my jam. Unless I plan that of like, I have planned that these three months I will not work. This is a sabbatical. I'm going to sleep late. I'm going to eat pancakes, whatever that is. But yeah, the first maybe six weeks I was just kind of playing and goofing off and enjoying the freedom but I quickly was like I need to do work because I like to work. You don't point unless you enjoy it.

Jamila Souffrant 22:00

Yeah. So how did you choose then the next thing to do? What was your next step? Did you take some of that money and start something else?

Lisa Nicole Bell 22:07

I took that money and started investing. Because I was just like, I didn't understand the markets the way I do now, I didn't understand how the various streams of income worked. And so I was like, now I have a little bit of money to play with, I have time to play with. And I was putting money in my own projects. I was like, I want to do some theater stuff. So I wrote directed and produced a show that went up here, three sold out weekends, NAACP theater award, that whole thing. So that was really gratifying and then put money into a digital docuseries called The American Dream revised and then license that to Procter and Gamble. So it was like, now I have more control, which was always the attention freedom and control because I have money. So if I want to go to someone else and raise money for whatever I'm doing great. But if I want to be in a situation where I don't have to answer to anybody, I get to do exactly what I want to do how I want to do it. It's nice to have money to do that, and to not have to eat ramen in the process. That was really the approach I took. And then we have a vision and we think we know exactly what we want to be doing. But oftentimes, we don't really until we do it. You know, that's how sometimes people's manifestation of their dreams is very anticlimactic. Because they're like, I worked so hard, I finally got it. And this is not how I thought it would feel. This is not what I thought I would be doing with my time. So during those following years, I was very intentional about like, I'm just going to try this on for size. I don't know if I'm going to like it. But the bet is small enough that if I don't, it's just a lesson learned. It's not like why I invested 10 years and millions of dollars trying to do this. So it was a lot of like, I call them learning bets just like little tests of like, do I like working with large groups of people in a leadership capacity. Do I like working with large groups of creative people? What do I want my multiple income stream configuration to look like? Yeah, it was just a lot of learning.

Jamila Souffrant 24:11

Do you feel like because you knew you had money saved up from the sale, that you could take those risks in those look like smaller learning bets? Would you have done let's just say you never created that company. But you still had that, you know, all these things you want to do and try out? How would you have approached it, then you would have been different in terms of how much risk you took, or how you went about it for some people maybe listening that says, well, I have a lot of things I want to do. But you know, I don't necessarily, I don't have like a fallback plan or a fallback money. If this fails kind of thing. How would you say they should approach that or how would you have approached it differently?

Lisa Nicole Bell 24:45

Yeah, this is gonna sound counterintuitive, but when you have nothing, that's the best time to make bets because there's nothing to lose. Having a little bit of money is really a gift and a curse because if you didn't grow up wealthy, you don't assume you will always have money. And so you get a little bit and you're like, let me hold on to this, like, I'm not spending any money, because I don't know when the next things come in and all of that you can quickly slip into this weird scarcity mentality before you realize it. So I think part of it is realizing that bets can be made at all scales. No a $500 bet $100 bet is every bit as good as a $5,000 bet. So part of it is like the size and understanding that if the test you want to run or the bet you want to make takes seven grand, and you got two grand and scale it down to two grand. And I did that. I mean, I could have made a project for $300,000. And I was like, No, we're gonna make this project for $30,000. So what do I need to adjust and shift in order to make this fit what I have decided the budget will be so there's that part of it, but the other part of it was that during the time that I was in college, I had been broke. It's a weird thing. I think a lot of life middle class and upper middle class people will relate to this, where it's like you come from a stable environment, you have family that has money, even if they aren't necessarily wealthy. You didn't want for things growing up, but then you came into your early adulthood and like you broke, like, broke broke for a period of time. I think it's character building. You know, I know a lot of people are gonna be like, no, sis it's not, but I feel like for me, it was a because what it showed me was, I'm okay, I'll be okay, I'll be broke, I won't be able to pay bills. And I'll call people that don't have it. Let's create a payment plan, or I'll pay you when I get it. But like the people who are not going to come and choke you to death, if you can't pay the bills, like if your credit score goes down 20 points. It's not the end of the world it can come back. So it just gave me a certain resilience and optimism in that if you hit rock bottom, the only other place to go is up. So why would you not take that bet it's safer to take the bet and to not take it and so that became my philosophy is like if I lose every dollar, I have so what? Money, you can get more of. Time you cannot.

Jamila Souffrant 27:05

Right? And that allows you then to take risk at all scales. When you determine the scale, you want to take the risk. So I spoke to Brian Portnoy yesterday. And I know So guys, I don't know when this episode comes out if it comes before, after Brian's episode, but Brian wrote the book, The Geometry of Wealth, and actually saw you posted at least on your stories about it. So I was like, oh, what is Lisa reading? Let me check that out, bought the book, love the book. And then so I interviewed him, and he has something in there. I mean, he has a lot of great concepts in there. But the other thing was just like, it's not that you'll ever escape failure or things going wrong. It's not that it's going to happen to people that expect it to happen, and can adapt as necessary. Not that they're trying to like be risk free, but just manage the risk will succeed in life. And I think that's the same that way with your finances, your career, all of it is intertwined together, right? Like things will not go as planned may go wrong. And if you're expect it to just all be laid out perfect. And roses. That's not it. And if you can find the lessons from whatever situation you're in, even if it's like Jamila is here talking about financial independence, I'm just trying to like pay off this debt that I can't even like manage. It's just like, what is the lesson there? So I just wanted to like, throw that in there because I thought it definitely relates to what you just said.

Lisa Nicole Bell 28:22

Yeah, that's a brilliant point, we can very easily get caught up in comparing where we are to where someone else is, and feeling like, we can't do anything because we can't do what they can do. But this is why I'm always saying I mean, as cheesy as it sounds, that gratitude is the gateway to abundance. Because when you are grateful you become more aware of what you have. And really achieving your own version of success is not about replicating what someone else has done, or lamenting, not having what they have. It's like, well, this is what I have. So what can I make with this? It's like being on an episode of Chopped, where it's like, this is what's in my basket. What can I make and, and the thing about it is it forces creativity, it forces resilience, it forces resourcefulness, but more importantly, it forces you to value who you are and what you bring to the table, which is important for creating authentic success.

Jamila Souffrant 29:15

I love that love that. So you do different types of projects. Now I you know, so I want your website it's like, across all spectrums, like movies, TV shows digital stuff. How do you choose the stuff that you work on? Right? Do you follow passion, like something that you're excited about? Or you're forward looking to the return on it? Is it a balance and thinking more deeply when people are due that you have limited resources or time when they're thinking about things that they should pursue? Is it following passion? Or following what's the best return on their money kind of thing, what what leads you to the decisions you make with the projects you choose?

Lisa Nicole Bell 29:52

So I'm really big on decision making framework because I feel like particularly for multi hyphenates it's very easy for you to just be all over the place here, just multi hypenates who are all over the place, but also, you can end up starting a lot of projects and never finishing, because you have shiny object syndrome, and you're just all over the place. So this is why when people like it seems like she's always I'm like, no, I'm not going to run a Google search I finished when I started. Right? I might have a lot of projects, but I go from soup to nuts. And then I move on to the next thing. Also, I'm very clear about my aptitude and my talents. So in some cases, you know, there may be a project where I'm like, I'm just a producer here. I'm not this is not my lane to be writing or doing anything else. It's my job to give everyone else the tools they need to make this happen. And in other cases, I'm like, you know, you take something like the podcast where it's like, no, I'm the host. I'm the Executive Producer, because it makes sense for me to host this. This is a place where I shine. It's a skill that I have.

Lisa Nicole Bell 30:59

So I think that's first thing like in terms of like self awareness, you have to know what you're great at. Not good at, not want to be better at, like, what are you great at? Where do you add the most value? Because when you're honest with yourself about that, a lot of projects filter themselves out because they're just not right for you. But I think that creativity and commerce can coexist it's not necessary to say, Well, I want to make a lot of money. So I have to go do something boring and uninteresting, and safe. And it's also unwise to say, Well, I'm going to follow my passion and do what I love. It's really important. And this is part of why I love having a business degree because I had to take managerial accounting, and I had to take price theory and things that forced me into thinking about how things scale, not that everything has to scale. But if this wasn't at a scale, what would that look like? And getting down to the nitty gritty of the economics of everything, because if you create a project and say, you know what, I'm not doing this for money, like this is a passion project. And I just want to do this because I care about it. Here's how much time I'm going to allocate to it. That's a personal decision. But if you're doing that with no awareness of what it cost you to create that thing, then you're hustling backwards. So I always start with like, where can I add value? Is this right for me in terms of what I do? Well, then it's if this fails, what is the worst case scenario? Would this be ruinous to me? Would it just hurt my ego a little bit? You know, that kind of thing. And at the very least, will I meet or connect with people who I can work with in the future? You know, even if this doesn't work out?

Lisa Nicole Bell 32:40

But the other thing is like, what if this goes really really well? What if this goes viral and turns into this huge thing? Is that something I want? Am I okay with my role in this if this becomes bigger than I anticipate, because we think about like, Oh, I mean, I'd be embarrassed if this fails, but like, are you going to be okay if it's really successful, because that's thing that that's there also. So there's those things and then I'm a person who gets really specific with the numbers. Like, if you know how much money you say you want to be making every year, then you should have $1 amount assigned to one hour of your time. And so it should be very easy to do the math and say, alright, this is about how many hours this project is going to take. And then you add 30%, because like you said, things never goes as planned. Because when you start to look at those numbers on paper, it becomes very sobering. When you're just like, you know what, I think I'm gonna write a novel. Like, are you really want to run the numbers on that real quick? Because once you do, you have to ask yourself how bad you want that like, and not on some like, well, this is my pie in the sky dream, but like, does this make sense? Yes, creatively, I might be leaning toward doing this. But does this make sense? And if I decide to make still make that decision in that investment, that's okay. But I did it with an awareness of what's going on, not three years from now looking back realizing that I'm broke by my own hand.

Jamila Souffrant 34:06

Okay, I love that informed decision making, because you can have a project or something you want to do like writing a novel, and understand the time commitment, the cost, the opportunity cost, given up on the other things you can't do because of writing that novel, and look forward and say, Well, if this does not succeed in the way I want, Will I still be okay? Because then if you only expect that it will succeed which you know I definitely believe in, you know, making sure you're visualizing success, but also just being realistic. Like if this doesn't work, what's the worst that can happen? Will I still be okay with the product? I think that's the key to like, will I still be proud of the product that this produces. Will I, or the person that I became doing this product? Is it worth it? It was and most time well, for me when I think about it in that way. It's like yes, it was worth it even without the monetary gain. But let's be real sometimes the monetary gain is the biggest thing for people.

Lisa Nicole Bell 34:58

That matters. Yeah, you make an error. Excellent point, because sometimes the reason a project fails is not through your own doing or your own lack of talent. It's timing. It's other people. I mean, you know, think about all the people who were on the brink of something magnificent and then COVID-19 happened. It's like, that's beyond anyone's control or expectation. So yeah, that's an excellent point.

Jamila Souffrant 35:20

Yeah. And then you think about that creativity is born from times like this. So I think you mentioned the series already, but I saw that you produce them The American Dream, Revise the Dream Series. And it was like done after the 2008 kind of recession, about entrepreneurs, and how they had to be creative. And I was like, well, that could just like, be popped over again into this situation about, you know, people like it's the same story again. For entrepreneurs, I have, you know, a vast amount of type of people who listen to this, some are working in a career for someone else, totally fine. Some are entrepreneurs or want to be entrepreneurs have a side hustle. The creativity side, I feel like is great like sometimes I feel like then it's pressure though, like I'll have to be so creative, to break through the noise and to stand out and to make money. Versus I just need to do this well and you know, have a purpose like how, like for you now even what the things that you're choosing to do or not to and what you envision the kind of opportunities that come for this. What does an entrepreneur someone who wants to be an entrepreneur like do in these times with their ideas?

Lisa Nicole Bell 36:24

My answer now has changed. At the time when I started my entrepreneurship journey entrepreneurs weren't rock stars. It wasn't sexy. It wasn't, you know, memes on Instagram and all of this. It was it was just work. It was gritty. It was all nighters. It was it wasn't glamorized the way it is now. And so my entree into the space was very pure. It was because I cared I was passionate, I wanted to hustle. But now I think a lot of people are doing it because it seems like the right thing to do. It looks sexy. They want to be on planes. They don't want to work for anybody. else's kind of thing. But I think first it's like, again, that thing of like temperament, being honest with yourself, because it takes tremendous like herculean levels of discipline to be a good entrepreneur to work for yourself. And I don't think people realize that they think, well, I get to wake up whatever time I want every day, girl, I wish I could do that. But they're like, I don't want to work for other people and work for myself. And it's like, but do you realize that if you woke up literally every day, with nowhere that you had to be, you don't have to, no one's going to come find you. No one's gonna call and ask you where you are. You're not going to get points. You're not going to get docked. You know, there's not going to be an immediate consequence for it. Most people don't have the discipline to say, I'm going to wake up I am going to brush my teeth. I am going to eat. I'm going to structure my day. I'm going to plan it out. I'm going to work for 4,5,6,7,8,9,10 hours that day.

Lisa Nicole Bell 37:58

Oh, what happened instead? Every day, and I have three things that I didn't finish this week, well guess what we're doing Saturday morning, working, no, we're not going to brunch we're working. And then we will find other time for all the other things we want to do. It's a level of discipline that most people do not appreciate. So that's the first thing is like being honest with yourself about how much self control you actually have. After that, though, I think it's being clear about your intentions, because I think a lot of people are honest with themselves, they just want to be poppin. You know, like, they want to be popping on the gram. They want all the people who doubted them to be wrong. You know, it's like these kinds of things that you become a prisoner of if you are not careful.

Jamila Souffrant 38:44

Yeah. And don't offer a return on money either because you can be poppin on the gram and you're not getting paid.

Lisa Nicole Bell 38:48

No Return on it. Or you know, or you know, because it's become so glamorize. They're seeing how sexy and fun It looks. But that's marketing. Okay. A lot of these entrepreneurs who may have had a business who were like, now I'm going to do retreats and speaking engagements and books and stuff. That's marketing. Of course, they have to make it look glamorous. How else would they rope you in? If they told you that they have international clients, and they sometimes have to get up at 330 in the morning to do an hour long call with them. And I'm not talking about 330 to ride to the airport. I'm about 330 turn your brain on to have an intelligent conversation. You don't want to do it because that doesn't sound good. That's not fun. If they told you that they were in the red for the first four years of their business, okay, they couldn't buy their family Christmas gifts and people ridiculed them. They wouldn't tell you that. If they told you that they drove the same car for 10 years old raggedy car that you hear coming from down the block because they were putting all their money into their business. You wouldn't do it. So they have to create these really dramatic stories and it has to look sexy and fun.

Jamila Souffrant 39:59

Yeah. I want to just hop in there because what people do though is that when they do make it, quote, unquote, from all appearances, they will relate back to those struggle days and moments so that they can relate to the people in those painful moments themselves. Like, oh, I struggled. I was broke poor and couldn't pay my bills. And look at me now kind of thing which, listen, I'm not trying to like down anyone who's like, marketing like that, because that's actually I think, smart. Because you know, if that's your story, and you've been able to come from that.

Lisa Nicole Bell 40:27


Jamila Souffrant 40:28

You have something you can teach someone. Right, but I just wanted to pop that in there.

Lisa Nicole Bell 40:31

Yeah. 100%. One hundred percent. So I think the thing is that, like you were saying earlier, things will go wrong. That doesn't stop just because you've become quote, unquote, successful. And you were in Forbes and you got to go to this, this TEDx talk about this sense of like, wow, something that I wanted to happen didn't happen, does not stop. I call them platinum problems or champagne problems, you do start to have more sophisticated problems and problems that other people people wish they had, but there are problems nonetheless. So I think that's really important. But the other thing is to remember that entrepreneurship and business and startups is not about your ego. It's not about becoming a billionaire. It's not about magazine covers, it's solving a problem. And when you are intentional about solving a problem for a group of people, there's a level of passion that comes with that. And when you start to lean into that, all kinds of interesting things bloom. So I think right now, more than ever, that's what's most urgent is like, are you solving the problem because now we're in a space where everybody's hyper aware of money, everybody's hyper aware of work. So a lot of the luxury is nonsense that people wanted to entertain before they want now. So either you are truly solving a problem and addressing a need and a desire or you are not and the market will quickly tell you that so it's kind of forcing people to be honest I think.

Jamila Souffrant 42:01

Right and it's important to note that you can have this entrepreneurial mindset at a job working for someone can still solving your boss's problem and see your clients problem within that structure too.

Lisa Nicole Bell 42:13

Yeah, intrapreneurship is a thing. And also like, to me, if you have a job that you love, and you also happen to have a side hustle or some other thing that you do that generates income, that's a great place to be. Don't let these people have you thinking that if you're not a full time entrepreneur, you're doing it wrong. It's not necessary, because the goal is freedom. And that means something different for all of us. It also realize that some of these people wish they could get a job, but they can't. Entrepreneurship so they have to do not that they want to do.

Jamila Souffrant 42:46

So true. And that's why I fell in love with the concept of financial independence, retire early the movement, because it showed me another way that you could become a millionaire become rich and it may take a little longer if you doing it through a job where you get you're getting paid. And so it's like a cap on the money and over time, but you just really intentionally saving and investing. But it's like, oh, I can reach freedom in this way too. It may take a little longer or not, you know, if I want to start my own business, but it's possible, I think for a lot of people, even if it's not that ultimate, I've saved and invested enough money, I don't have to work again. But the steps that it takes to get there, like the paying off the debt being more intentional, like all that will unfold anyway on the path. So it puts you in a better position.

Lisa Nicole Bell 43:29

100% because at the core of it, it's like if you have multiple streams of income, you don't have to be a full time entrepreneur to do that. There's so many things that you can do, you can be a startup investor, and have a full time job. So yeah, I think is really important too. And I mean, the quarantine has really forced a lot of self reflection. But it's really important to say, Well, what do I want? What is my vision? How do I make that as interesting and sexy as I want it to be? Because the other thing is a lot of the people who are posturing don't even have that it the way you think they have it, they don't. It's not what you think it is. It's like it's a story. It's an image. It's being woven for specific purposes. So, yeah, this is why, you know, I harp on values a lot. Because when you know what your values are, and you are living in a way that's aligned with them, a lot of the FOMO and the anxiety of am I doing enough and cool enough? Am I hanging with the right people, that stuff melts away because you have a sense of peace with yourself because you're like, you know, I'm waking up every day. My habits are aligned with what I say is important to me. And I'm doing something that's meaningful. So the rest of it is just icing.

Jamila Souffrant 44:38

Right? Love that. And so you have a passion for teaching about lifestyle design. We were talking about it essentially here, right? So I do want to take a step back and just talk about lifestyle design right now. So if someone's like, alright, living my life, and they talk about this lifestyle design, and but what is that, like? How can someone be more intentional about their life, their career, their money intertwining it at all waking up and feeling like they have more control.

Lisa Nicole Bell 45:04

Yeah, I mean, most people I think are living life as it has happened to them, not as they have designed it. So my obsession with lifestyle design started because shortly before I sold my first company, I discovered personal development. The Power of Positive Thinking by Norman Vincent Peale was the first personal development book I ever read. And after that, I was like, What is this? Oh my god, where's this been my whole life? And so from there, I just was like, well, why is it that some people seem to live these very happy and fulfilled lives and other people don't? Like is it that some people just are more deserving is like, no, that can't be it. And I began to realize that it's it actually comes down to a series of choices, because I used to listen to some of Tony Robbins talks and be like, this dude is crazy. Like, oh, this is not it can't be used. It's just a decision. It just comes down to a decision. Like, yeah. Well, what I started to realize was like, if somebody's fit, you know, they have like, snatched waist and the curves. And it's like, well, how did this person get this? Well, first they decided that that was what they wanted. They're going to be certain things about a person's life and about their experience that are just serendipitous blessings. You know, you're just grateful for that. But for a lot of things, especially the people that we admire as being successful, they've been incredibly intentional about saying this is what I want. I had a girlfriend a few weeks a few months ago, actually when the who was like, Oh my goodness, Lisa, if I had your body I would never work clothes like you. You always look so snatched and you did and I was like, okay, she's like, Okay, so what do I need to do? Like, okay, well, I need to work out five days a week, using 100 ounces of water every day. All these little trips to Jack In the Box and this nonsense. You have cut all that out. You need to start cooking your own meat. She was like, I can't do all of that or I don't know, how do you find that motivation, there is no motivation. It's discipline, discipline picks up where motivation leads off. So that's an example of something where it was like, I want to look a certain way. And there's a price you have to pay to do that. There's there's nothing more to it than that it is get the information, execute consistently. That's it. So when we think about wellness, we think about relationships, we think about career, we think about money, that's all that it comes down to. It's like, decide what it is that you want. Execute, right, go get the information and execute. The thing about it is we live in an age where the information that you want on practically anything that you want to do is available, and you could do the $15 book version, or the 1500 dollar bootcamp version, everything in between. So the other thing is like sometimes when people discover this, they think, wow, I got to overhaul my whole life. Okay, I'm about to switch up my hair routine. I'm about to get married in two years, and it have kids, it's like, hold on, you can't do all of it at once. Right? Because you do have bandwidth mentally and emotionally. So figure out what's most urgent. And the thing about habits is like, once you develop the habit of, say, working out consistently, that's a, there's a transference there, saving becomes easier because the muscle of doing what you need to do, whether you feel like it or not, is a lot stronger. And so then you get to a cruising altitude with fitness, you're like, I don't have to think about it anymore. I know that on Friday, I'm going to the gym. That's it. You're like, I need to be putting away $500 a month, $1,000 a month into my savings. I'm going to automate it so that there's nothing to think about. The money that I have in my account is what's left for me to use. And you apply those principles to every part of your life. And before you know it, you look up and you're like, I was pretty damn good. Like I did something I'm proud of.

Jamila Souffrant 48:55

Yeah, and like you said, it's being so intentional and being willing to also enjoy the process while it may be hard, and there's things like I picked up running now, and I just like, I don't like it. I'm just like, why do people run as soon as I start running, I'm just like, this is so dumb. And so my husband like, we go running and like, he just, you know, he's always like passing me. I'm just like, whatever. But I've realized, though, that I actually do like, like on below, I like it, because if I hated it, I wouldn't do it. And I like the results of it. And I like that it pushes me and all these things. So I find that sometimes Yeah, you're not necessarily in joying it but you deep down need to find some sort of joy in it. Because you don't so any process or any goal that you're trying to reach whether money goals, career goals, body goals, all that there'd be some sacrifices, but I find that the people who actually get the results and feel good, like they're actually enjoying the sacrifices.

Lisa Nicole Bell 49:54

Yeah, no, you're 100% right. I mean, this was one of the things I said to the friend. I was like, um, she's like, Well healthy food doesn't taste good I was like, sis this is why seasoning exists there's seasonings other than salt that you can put on things that makes them delicious. So that's a good point because even the the treasury of the things that we want can be made more pleasant relative to our personality and you know, I'm like you it was like, for a long time I thought well, I just have to do hours and hours on the treadmill if I want to be in shape, and then I discovered weightlifting and I was like, oh snap, like this I enjoy. This is getting me where I need to go like, I only have to do hit cardio twice a week and I can be snatched, perfect game on like, I'm willing to go and lift three, four days a week if it means I don't have to do a ton of cardio so it's like you got to find the configuration that works for you. And not just think well if I don't want to do it this particular way then I quit I just be fat.

Jamila Souffrant 50:48

Right? Perfect. It's keep you it's keeping on trying different things. Not giving up. If something is not for you. It doesn't you don't like it. Because the cool sets if I if I didn't really not, did not enjoy running Find something else like to do that helps me get to that goal. Okay, so for Lisa now, how do you manage money? Or what's your financial goals? So I know we first connected I was on your podcast and talked about financial independence and all that. But is that a goal that you are working towards? It's something you've already accomplished. But for you, you enjoy working. So you're working and where are you right now on the journey to financial independence?

Lisa Nicole Bell 51:22

I feel super fortunate and that, like there's money for the things that I want to do, and you'll be able to relate to this. It's such a weird place when you have passive income streams that cover your lifestyle because you're not working for money anymore. That point like the way you go about even managing money changes. So now it really is like, okay, there's an amount of money necessary for me to function and exist, but then there's an amount of money that allows me to give very generously to causes I care about That's where I'm going now. That's where I'm thinking now about like legacy and impact. And so I'm ramping up my passive income streams, because I'm like, that's the way I'm going to be able to get there. Also, because I just am addicted to being able to choose things for myself, and being able to say no to things that I feel like are not the right fit. I may have other strategic reasons for making a decision, like, Okay, I'm going to do this, but not for the money for something else. I like that. Because it means that I don't have to be on the treadmill of, well, how am I going to pay my utility bill? If I don't do this, I have to do this. I have to do this. I would like to be in a to remain, I should say in a situation where it's like, Hmm, this could lead someplace interesting, because sometimes distractions are opportunities. You know, it's like, this is a possibility. But you can only fully explained that if you've got money in the bank. So it's important to me to make maintain my passive income streams. And this idea that you're not incurring additional liabilities until you have an asset that can pay for it. That's, again, a level of discipline that is not easy to achieve. But I'm there, you know, like, there's stuff where I'm like, oh, I should get that. And I'm like, oh,

Jamila Souffrant 53:21

So what's an example of that? Like something that you're like, Oh, I should have got, I want that, but it's just not a smart move right now.

Lisa Nicole Bell 53:27

So here's a great example. I was thinking that I wanted to buy a Porsche Macan right. And first of all, I'm a hardcore SUV junkie. I love SUVs. They're my jam. So it was like, okay, of all of the SUVs I could buy, like, which one will I choose? And I was like, well, what is the happy medium between the luxury that I want? That I know I can't afford? And in this decision? Because the other thing was like, Alright, from a standpoint of buying a car outright, you know, like, I have a personal hang up with buying brand new cars off the lot because of depreciation. So I'm like, not gonna happen. So like, Okay, if I want to pay cash for a car, or if I want to, like let's say I want my credit score to go up even higher, and so I want to finance part of it and make a huge down payment and then make payments on time and now I'm in the eight hundreds and that kind of thing. I was like, Alright, how do I manipulate the situation to fit my goals? I found a luxury car that I was like, Oh, this works like I like this a lot. And perhaps more importantly, if I buy this car, I will not have regrets about it. I will feel happy I will walk to it and go hey, let's go! Instead of being like, oh God, like I'm gonna park around the corner and walk like it. You know, it was like the happy medium between those two things, but the gap. The reason I'm bringing it up there is an example of the gap in price was about $20,000, which, on its face is not a ton of money depending on where you are, especially when you're thinking about the life of the loan. But at the same time, I wanted to buy more investment property at that time. So I was like, is this is a mobile home, this is the down payment on a property in a certain part of the country. This is rehab costs for house that you may buy, like, like we were saying earlier, like going back to the opportunity cost. Sometimes people think that once you make a certain amount of money that that goes away, like oh, I'm just gonna be spending money like water I'll be in Balenciaga balling out. It's like, no, not if you're smart. Because every time you achieve another milestone, there's still further for you to go. And so, yes, you will have nicer things. But if you're smart, you're not going to be frivolous with your money because at the end of the day, it's not really how much money you make. It's what you keep.

Jamila Souffrant 55:58

Yeah, and it goes back to when you don't have a lot, this is your training ground. So if you find yourself where it's like, I'm not where I want to be financially, there's money out, I want to make more money, decisions you make now with what you have now will set you up and train you to be better with the money that is going to abundantly come to you. Okay, I have to ask this question, because you talked about passive income streams, and you alluded to property. So can you explain just what your passive income streams are? Because I know people are like, okay, so Lisa is doing it, and she has passive income streams, like, what are the things so I can try to do those things, too.

Lisa Nicole Bell 56:28

Yeah. So there's royalties. years ago, I wrote a book and then created an anthology called the Legacy Letters. And then I turned that into a live show. So the anthology itself is a physical book. And going back to our conversation about scale, I was like, Okay, I could be out here, you know, hustling and hawking these books $12 to $15 at a time, or I could go to organizations and say, I'll sell these to you. In quantities of 5000. So that was the approach I took to that. And it's one of those things that you create once and then you get paid over and over again for. So that's one of them. And there's the licensing of content. So one of the cool things about having a body of work is that you end up with all of this intellectual property. And a lot of times people are kind of like, well, that's over. There's nothing I can do with that now. But, for example, when I created a licensing deal with Procter and Gamble, you know, when I put that deal together, I was like, You got 12 months, and then you have to renew that. And if you don't, that reverts to me, and I get to license it to someone else. So I periodically sit down and go through the library, and I'm like, What are the licensing opportunities here? Because there's literally no cost to it, aside from an attorney putting together a contract.

Jamila Souffrant 57:49

These are projects you've already done that people still want to use for content.

Lisa Nicole Bell 57:53

Yes. So that's another good point. Because at the time when I was creating them, I wasn't necessarily thinking about them being evergreen. But it is important that if you are a content creator, that you if a lot of your stuff is very current, make some stuff that's evergreen make some stuff that in 10 years will still be relevant because it does become an income stream if you structure it correctly. So there's that there's residuals from film and TV stuff. That's just deal structure of like, sometimes people want to pay you a lump sum, and then that's it. They got the rights forever. And it's as simple as saying, no, I'd like 5% on whatever the net is that comes from this. So that kind of stuff, then yeah, the real estate investment properties of just like you, I mean, you know how that goes where it's just like, alright, I'm doing my landlord dance or you bring in your management company and that kind of thing. I think a lot of it is that sometimes artists think that starving is something that's that has to be inherent to their process or that if they are not actively working, if the phone is not ringing, that means that it's everything's drying up, but it's like that, that doesn't need to be the case. You know a little bit of thoughtfulness, a little bit of betting on yourself in terms of how you structure your deals can mean passive income for a very long time. So there's that and then I just got into peer to peer lending.

Jamila Souffrant 59:20

Okay, yeah, Mm hmm.

Lisa Nicole Bell 59:22

I'm excited to see how that goes. And then of course the markets I lost money like everybody else recently and I just didn't look I was like you know, I'm just my way of coping with this is to not look so like from March to May I just was like, I'm not just let's just pretend like it's not happening and then tapped in.

Jamila Souffrant 59:46

Yeah, night I agree with not looking if you don't have to, because it's going to do what it does anyway. So basically, you have diversified income streams. And part of I think this is the last like point I want to make and then I would just love for people to find out where they can follow you and learn more about you. But also, as part of this now, your net work, who you know, and you know, the right people to approach in the right companies, because I might have this idea for finance, like curriculum or program or for a company. And it's like, all right, what do I start? Like? What company is most going to be receptive to this? And then if I even know the company, who am I going to approach in the company? Like, you know, like, I think that would have a big part to do with it too, right?

Lisa Nicole Bell 60:28

Yeah, I mean, I've always been a person who believed in building a network and nurturing a network, and one that is diverse. I think this is part of why I've been able to do things across different verticals, with relative ease is because if I meet someone, and it's not immediately obvious to me how I could work with them or help them or they could help me, I still stay in touch. It doesn't have to be transactional right away in order to be valuable, and there's been times where I've met someone, two years go by and it's just kind of like how how you doing, how are your kids doing? And that's the extent of it and then something comes up and it's like, Oh, you know what I should reach out to so and so because the other thing that happens is that the world is actually a very small in terms of people who are successful. And so even if the person you're talking to isn't the person, they might know the person, they may be two degrees from the person. So I'm very much into keeping my fences mended, keeping people updated on kind of what I'm doing what I'm looking for, because sometimes people know each other that you're like, how do y'all know each other? So um, yeah, I think that that is a part of it. Any successful person's job, no matter what field you're in, whether you work in a job and have a career or you're an entrepreneur, relationships are a form of currency for sure.

Jamila Souffrant 61:47

Yes, yes. Love that. Okay. Lisa, where can everyone find you keep up with you? All the things.

Lisa Nicole Bell 61:55

My digital home base is L-I-S-A-N-I-C-O-L-E-B-E-L-L dot com. And I have a newsletter that goes out once a month called Cue that largely centers on mindset psychology, lifestyle, design, all that good stuff. So if you like the content of this chat, you will probably enjoy Cue. I'm always curating stuff there. I also have a podcast called Behind the Brilliance where I sit down and have long form conversations with innovators and entrepreneurs about their lives in a work. So yeah, I'm I like to talk about these things and share because we're living in a very interesting time and it comes with its challenges, but certainly, we have more opportunity than generations prior. So I feel like we should all take advantage of that.

Jamila Souffrant 62:40

Yes, and I love that I will definitely share all the contact information there. And one note about what I love about your social media is that you know, like you'll see like the people on social media they have like, hundred thousand followers and you know, you assume that they're making money and you're so low key on social media. Like your Instagram you hardly update it. When you up you know, like it just feels like it That's the kind of level of success I want, where it's just like, it's happening behind the scenes, like, you know, I'm good for it, the content is there, I don't have to, like post something for you to know that I'm popping. It's just like, you know that like the receipts when you find out more about me, they're there. So I love that about your style, that it's real work behind it. It's not just the nice picture.

Lisa Nicole Bell 63:18

Yeah, cuz I mean, look, maintaining those poppin social media profiles. That's a job.

Jamila Souffrant 63:26

Yeah, it takes a lot of work.

Lisa Nicole Bell 63:28

It's very time consuming to do that. And I mean, I just got to a point where I was like, do you want to be famous and broke? Or do you want to be wealthy and satisfied and the real ones know if you know, you know, and then other people may or may not know. I just realized that like, it's also a two edged sword to have, like, you know, 500,000 people following me and those things may happen. I'm not saying that they won't. So I'll take things as they come. But in order to like be pursuing that, it just felt like well, that's not the right use of time and understand if you continue to do the work. The people who need to know about you will know and also social media, in my opinion, is very much quantity over quality because the people who are paying attention are the people I want paying attention like there are people who can help me get things done and the rest is icing.

Jamila Souffrant 64:16

Love, love, love that. Okay, thank you so much Lisa for this conversation.

Lisa Nicole Bell 64:19

Thank you. It was such a pleasure.

Jamila Souffrant 64:25

Okay, journeyers. I really hope you are even more fueled up for your journey to financial freedom and independence. You know, with Lisa, I was I was really encouraged and inspired to talk to her after listening to her podcast and being a guest on her podcast because you're here like she's so low key on social media, but you can tell by her receipts and her portfolio and just the way that she talks that she's living like that life. And I wanted to just highlight that for you guys have her on the show, to show how you can truly create a life of design and you don't have to necessarily choose between money and creativity. You can do both. And so I hope you found some inspiration and some action items and things you can actually do from listening to Lisa. One of them is to definitely check out her podcast Behind the Brilliance.

Jamila Souffrant 65:13

Don't forget if you want the episode show notes to get any of the links mentioned in this episode, go to or click the description wherever you're listening to this to get the link to the show notes. And if you want that free jumpstart guide to help you on your financial freedom journey, text launch to 33777 text launch to 33777 to get your free guide today or go to If you want to support me in the podcast and love the free content and information that you get here, here are four ways that you can support me in the show. One, make sure you're subscribed to the podcast wherever you listen, whether that's Apple podcasts, that purple app on your phone phone, your Android device, YouTube Spotify, wherever it is that you happen to listen, just subscribe so you are not missing an episode. And if you're happening to listen to this and Apple podcasts, rate review and subscribe there, I appreciate and read every single review. Number two follow me on my social media accounts. I'm at journey to launch on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. And I love love love interacting with journey are there. Three, support and checkout the sponsors of this show if you hear something that interests you, sponsors are the main ways we keep the podcast lights on here. So show them some love for supporting your girl. Four and last but not least, share this episode this podcast with a friend or family member or co worker so that we can spread the message of Journey to Launch. Alright, that's it. Until next week, keep on journeying journeyers.

(This post may include some affiliate links)

This week on the Journey to Launch podcast, special guest, Lisa Nicole Bell, is sharing how she created her life by design and dived into entrepreneurship. Lisa is a producer, writer, media personality, and serial entrepreneur. In addition, she hosts a podcast called Behind the Brilliance, with nearly two million downloads and 200 episodes to date. 

In this episode, we discuss the truth about entrepreneurship, how to make informed business and life decisions, and taking risks. Lisa shares so many inspiring tips. This is one episode you don’t want to miss.

In this episode you will learn: 

  • What bets are worth taking and how to manage your risks
  • How to turn your content into multiple streams of income
  • The truth about entrepreneurship 
  • How to properly plan your time so you don’t hustle backwards
  • Ways to create a life by design and more

Special thanks to YNAB for sponsoring the podcast in its 3 year anniversary month. Get your free 34 trial of YNAB today (no credit card required to sign up) by going to

I'm listening to Episode 162 of the #journeytolaunch podcast, How to Create a Life by Design and Combine Creativity and Commerce with Lisa Nicole Bell! Share on X

Sign up for the Journey to Launch free class on July 16th here.

In This Free Online Workshop, You Will Learn:

1. What the elusive term of Financial Independence really means

2. The FIVE major stages you must move through on the journey to reaching Financial Independence and how to identify where you currently are on the journey

3. The barriers stopping you from reaching your goals and how to eliminate them

*It’s a virtual meeting so you can join us from anywhere by registering here.

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